kengr: (Default)
kengr ([personal profile] kengr) wrote2008-10-03 04:53 pm

Argh. Just Argh,

I've always loathed that bit in The Empire Strikes Back where Yoda says "No! Try not. Do. Or do not. There is no try."

It's a sentiment I encountered far too often from my mother when I was growing up.

And it is *damaging* because it fails to recognize that effort can be put forth and the desired results not reached.

So while many see it as a "you have to believe you can do it" thing, I (and others) see it as calling efforts that don't succeed the fault of the person making the attempt. And make them a personal flaw rather than a need for more training or whatever.

same sort thing is pushed by far too many Phys Ed teachers. Though they tended to go for "you aren't trying hard enough". Telling this to a kid who's having a minor asthma attack while trying to complete the laps you assigned is *not* going to help.

Now I find that there was even more wrong with that scene than I'd realized.

Use the Try Harder, Luke

If that transcript is true, even if Lucas was right about human nature, he was *so* wrong by bowing to it. When you are creating myths, you are supposed to make the heroes *better*. Make them folks who inspire people to try harder or to persevere when all seems lost.

I agree with Hamill. Luke was being a whiner and the way he was played in that scene was a disservice to the character.
ext_29896: Lilacs in grandmother's vase on my piano (Default)

[identity profile] glinda-w.livejournal.com 2008-10-03 11:59 pm (UTC)(link)
So while many see it as a "you have to believe you can do it" thing, I (and others) see it as calling efforts that don't succeed the fault of the person making the attempt. And make them a personal flaw rather than a need for more training or whatever.

Oh ghods. (me = someone else with that particular damage set.)

Just... word.
ext_29896: Lilacs in grandmother's vase on my piano (ocean)

[identity profile] glinda-w.livejournal.com 2008-10-04 02:07 am (UTC)(link)
Oh, even better. I was a straight A+ student, but was "only" twelfth in my class (of 365 students) instead of valedictorian like my mother was (of a class of 12, at a school for the blind).

Only perfect was good enough. *very wry* I'm a lot better about "good enough". One of Elise Matthesen's posts, where she quoted Mike Ford as saying something like all the false starts and unfinished projects are the compost a creative person needs to have... that made a huuuuuge impression, and freed up a lot.

But I've still got a long, long way to go.
ext_29896: Lilacs in grandmother's vase on my piano (Default)

[identity profile] glinda-w.livejournal.com 2008-10-04 02:09 am (UTC)(link)
Ah. I saved it in my quotefile.

He said that having started many more things than you finish is a natural state for anyone who is actually engaged in doing a lot of creative work. He said that those unfinished projects were part of an ecosystem, and served a purpose; they were the nurse logs on the forest floor. Having them is not failure; having them is part of how the natural process works.

When he told me this, it felt like a huge iron spike had been taken out of my heart, or something.
(from a post [livejournal.com profile] elisem made on 6/19/2007)

[identity profile] fayanora.livejournal.com 2008-10-04 01:49 pm (UTC)(link)
Wow. Just... wow. I love that quote.

[identity profile] gridlore.livejournal.com 2008-10-04 01:46 am (UTC)(link)
Yoda: "No! Try not. Do. Or do not. There is no try."

Obi-Wan Kenobi: "Only a Sith speaks in absolutes."

Darth Yoda was trying to screw Luke up, force him to run off and join the Dark Side!

[identity profile] fayanora.livejournal.com 2008-10-04 01:49 pm (UTC)(link)
Amen to everything you've said here. I've been encountering that bias in my own life, me putting forth all the effort I can to gain some actual control over myself* and having other people mistake it for laziness or apathy.


* Control to act. I already have control against action mastered. I am a master at stopping myself from doing or saying something I shouldn't. Too much of a master, in fact. Sometimes I have a hard time saying things I want to because the Filter won't let me.

[identity profile] fayanora.livejournal.com 2008-10-05 05:48 am (UTC)(link)
*Sigh* We should start a club or LJ community for people like us: the socially inept whose filters make it hard to speak.

[identity profile] janetmiles.livejournal.com 2008-10-06 09:13 am (UTC)(link)
I don't know if it will help you, but I've found that I can get past my filter by writing or by speaking a language other than English. Apparently the circuit that's involved in translation bypasses the Censor.

[identity profile] fayanora.livejournal.com 2008-10-07 10:41 am (UTC)(link)
That might help me if I knew any other languages but English.